美国国家公共电台 NPR Iran's Foreign Minister: Renegotiating Nuclear Deal Would Damage U.S. Credibility

 

STEVE INSKEEP, HOST:

Iran's foreign minister is making his case for a nuclear deal, plausibly¹, for the final time. Mohammad Javad Zarif is finishing a visit to the United Nations here. He arrived weeks before a deadline for President Trump² to extend U.S. participation³ in a deal that limits Iran's nuclear program. Trump has been pressing to withdraw or renegotiate, which Zarif does not accept at all.

MOHAMMAD JAVAD ZARIF: It is a package. You cannot pick and choose between the package and say, I want this, that and the other element improved.

INSKEEP: Do you mean to say that you will not negotiate any changes or additions to this agreement no matter what the United States and Europe may suggest?

ZARIF: I believe Europe has said that they're not prepared to renegotiate disagreements. And I think it's very prudent⁴ because anybody who participates in the negotiation⁵ of this deal would tell you that opening this package would be tantamount to opening a Pandora's box. And we'll never be able to close it.

INSKEEP: So the answer is no.

ZARIF: Yes.

INSKEEP: You're not going to talk this over again.

ZARIF: I think the United States doesn't want to send the message to the world that if you negotiate with the United States, the U.S. is going to come back and say, whatever I gave you, I want back.

INSKEEP: We met Zarif in Manhattan in the residence of Iran's U.N. ambassador. The foreign minister is in his late 50s. He was educated in the U.S., so he's making his case in a country he knows. He's racing⁶ from room to room arguing to diplomats⁷ and journalists that the agreement should stay. The deal negotiated under President Obama lifts some economic sanctions on Iran and provides permanent nuclear inspections⁸. Critics complain, though, that Iran's missiles are not covered and that some provisions eventually expire.

As you know, foreign minister, some possibilities discussed here include keeping the deal but seeking, in some way, to add to it - to add additional safeguards that would reassure⁹ the United States. As you have noted¹⁰ in your public statements here, the agreement itself says that Iran will not ever seek a nuclear weapon. If you've already committed to that, what would the harm be in negotiating additional safeguards or more years...

ZARIF: No, because...

INSKEEP: ...To the agreement or anything else?

ZARIF: No, because those years to the agreement are not years to the agreement. Those are years to limitations that we voluntarily accepted, but they were the subject of two years of negotiations¹¹. And now for the United States to come back and say, we need more, that would be violating the foundations of the agreement.

INSKEEP: But why do you care if you're not on planning on having a nuclear weapon ever?

ZARIF: Because our nuclear program was never intended to produce nuclear weapons. Now, I'm not asking you to rely on me. Director Pompeo, who's the head of the CIA and who should know everything, said according to the best of my knowledge - as head of CIA - Iran was not racing towards a bomb before the agreement and will not be racing towards a bomb if we break the agreement.

INSKEEP: Mike Pompeo, President Trump's nominee¹² for secretary of state, did say that during a confirmation¹³ hearing. The questions are harder, though, when it comes to Iran's involvement in its regions' wars.

Many people will know that Iran is supporting Syria's government in Syria's civil war.

ZARIF: No. No. We are fighting extremists.

INSKEEP: Yes, Iran's foreign minister just declined to say that his government supports Syria's government, even though many Iranian soldiers have been killed fighting alongside Syrian troops. Zarif says they're battling ISIS. Recent news makes it clear why he'd be so particular. Iran opposes chemical weapons, yet has not stopped chemical weapons attacks that are blamed on its Syrian allies. Meeting reporters over the weekend, Zarif seemed to suggest that fighting ISIS was simply more important than chemical weapons use, which prompted a follow-up question.

(SOUNDBITE OF ARCHIVED RECORDING)

UNIDENTIFIED PERSON: Why does it have to be one or the other with Assad? Why can't you keep ISIS from falling and also send a message to Assad to check it?

ZARIF: Because we live in the real world. And in that real world, you need to fight ISIS. And at the same time, we need to push for respect for international and humanitarian¹⁴ law. We're not there to defend anybody. We're there to defeat something.

INSKEEP: Because we live in the real world, we're not there to defend anybody. We are there to defeat something. What do you mean by that?

ZARIF: As I said, we do not support the use of chemical weapons. We reject the use of chemical weapons. We need to fight a serious enemy that is a threat to the international community. In the fight against that serious enemy, you cannot violate the rules of international law. And that is a principle that we stand on, and that is a principle that we ask all our friends to observe.

INSKEEP: Although, are you acknowledging you feel that you really can't do anything about whatever Bashar al-Assad may do with chemical weapons?

ZARIF: You see, what we have said time and again is that you're pushing a narrative¹⁵ that he used chemical weapons. We believe that we need international investigation¹⁶ of the sites - on-site investigation.

INSKEEP: Do you have any information that would indicate why it is that when international chemical weapons inspectors¹⁷ arrived in Syria after the most recent attack, it took them something more than a week to get any access to the site?

ZARIF: I talked to the Syrian foreign minister, and they were supposed to be taken to the site the following day. It seems that security could not have been arranged. It seems that there were snipers who were shooting at them. But what we insisted from the very beginning was the need to carry out an on-site investigation.

INSKEEP: Here in New York, Iran's foreign minister faces questions about more than chemical weapons. Last night at the Council on Foreign Relations, he was sharply asked about Iranian-Americans in Iranian jails. It is a different tone than a few years ago when Iran seemed to be opening to the world.

One other thing I want to ask about, foreign minister. People who follow the news - Americans who follow the news from Iran will know that, in recent months, there have been a number of protests on different issues relating to the economy, relating to women's rights. What in your view is going on in Iranian society right now?

ZARIF: Well, you see, that's the right of our people. Sometimes those demonstrations¹⁸ get violent. And the way they are treated when they get violent in the United States - the same way is in Iran. And the government has to listen to...

INSKEEP: But that's what I mean. If you look at protests that you mentioned in the United States, they mean something. There's an excessive amount of protest now because people are upset about race relations. People are upset about President Trump. People are upset about gun violence. The protests send a message about where the public is. What did the protests say about the public in Iran right now and what they want from your government?

ZARIF: Primarily that their expectations for economic development were not met. Let me give you one example. We create between 700,000 to 900,000 jobs every year. That's a very good figure. Look at your own statistics, but 1.2 million people enter the job market every year.

INSKEEP: You're not keeping up.

ZARIF: We're not keeping up, and there is disenfranchisement. There is dissatisfaction. I mean, a family that had one son or daughter unemployed¹⁹ now has two sons or daughters. Although we create so many jobs, it's not enough.

INSKEEP: Your president promised in his last re-election campaign to address that shortfall of jobs by ending more sanctions and improving relations with the world. How disappointing is it to you that he's not able to do that?

ZARIF: Well, he has been very much able to do that. The entire international community is moving forward with that. It's the United States which is preventing it and calls itself supportive of the Iranian people, which is very hypocritical.

INSKEEP: Foreign minister, thanks very much.

ZARIF: Thank you.

INSKEEP: Mohammad Javad Zarif starts home to Iran today knowing that President Trump makes his next decision on the nuclear deal within a few weeks.

1 plausibly   

似真地

参考例句：

• The case was presented very plausibly. 案情的申述似很可信。
• He argued very plausibly for its acceptance. 他为使之认可辩解得头头是道。

2 trump   

n.王牌，法宝；v.打出王牌，吹喇叭

参考例句：

• He was never able to trump up the courage to have a showdown.他始终鼓不起勇气摊牌。
• The coach saved his star player for a trump card.教练保留他的明星选手，作为他的王牌。

3 participation   

n.参与，参加，分享

参考例句：

• Some of the magic tricks called for audience participation.有些魔术要求有观众的参与。
• The scheme aims to encourage increased participation in sporting activities.这个方案旨在鼓励大众更多地参与体育活动。

4 prudent   

adj.谨慎的，有远见的，精打细算的

参考例句：

• A prudent traveller never disparages his own country.聪明的旅行者从不贬低自己的国家。
• You must school yourself to be modest and prudent.你要学会谦虚谨慎。

5 negotiation   

n.谈判，协商

参考例句：

• They closed the deal in sugar after a week of negotiation.经过一星期的谈判，他们的食糖生意成交了。
• The negotiation dragged on until July.谈判一直拖到7月份。

6 racing   

n.竞赛，赛马；adj.竞赛用的，赛马用的

参考例句：

• I was watching the racing on television last night.昨晚我在电视上看赛马。
• The two racing drivers fenced for a chance to gain the lead.两个赛车手伺机竞相领先。

7 diplomats   

n.外交官( diplomat的名词复数 )；有手腕的人，善于交际的人

参考例句：

• These events led to the expulsion of senior diplomats from the country. 这些事件导致一些高级外交官被驱逐出境。
• The court has no jurisdiction over foreign diplomats living in this country. 法院对驻本国的外交官无裁判权。 来自《简明英汉词典》

8 inspections   

n.检查( inspection的名词复数 )；检验；视察；检阅

参考例句：

• Regular inspections are carried out at the prison. 经常有人来视察这座监狱。
• Government inspections ensure a high degree of uniformity in the standard of service. 政府检查确保了在服务标准方面的高度一致。 来自《简明英汉词典》

9 reassure   

v.使放心，使消除疑虑

参考例句：

• This seemed to reassure him and he continued more confidently.这似乎使他放心一点，于是他更有信心地继续说了下去。
• The airline tried to reassure the customers that the planes were safe.航空公司尽力让乘客相信飞机是安全的。

10 noted   

adj.著名的，知名的

参考例句：

• The local hotel is noted for its good table.当地的那家酒店以餐食精美而著称。
• Jim is noted for arriving late for work.吉姆上班迟到出了名。

11 negotiations   

协商( negotiation的名词复数 )； 谈判； 完成（难事）； 通过

参考例句：

• negotiations for a durable peace 为持久和平而进行的谈判
• Negotiations have failed to establish any middle ground. 谈判未能达成任何妥协。

12 nominee   

n.被提名者；被任命者；被推荐者

参考例句：

• His nominee for vice president was elected only after a second ballot.他提名的副总统在两轮投票后才当选。
• Mr.Francisco is standing as the official nominee for the post of District Secretary.弗朗西斯科先生是行政书记职位的正式提名人。

13 confirmation   

n.证实，确认，批准

参考例句：

• We are waiting for confirmation of the news.我们正在等待证实那个消息。
• We need confirmation in writing before we can send your order out.给你们发送订购的货物之前，我们需要书面确认。

14 humanitarian   

n.人道主义者，博爱者，基督凡人论者

参考例句：

• She has many humanitarian interests and contributes a lot to them.她拥有很多慈善事业，并作了很大的贡献。
• The British government has now suspended humanitarian aid to the area.英国政府现已暂停对这一地区的人道主义援助。

15 narrative   

n.叙述，故事；adj.叙事的，故事体的

参考例句：

• He was a writer of great narrative power.他是一位颇有记述能力的作家。
• Neither author was very strong on narrative.两个作者都不是很善于讲故事。

16 investigation   

n.调查，调查研究

参考例句：

• In an investigation,a new fact became known, which told against him.在调查中新发现了一件对他不利的事实。
• He drew the conclusion by building on his own investigation.他根据自己的调查研究作出结论。

17 inspectors   

n.检查员( inspector的名词复数 )；（英国公共汽车或火车上的）查票员；（警察）巡官；检阅官

参考例句：

• They got into the school in the guise of inspectors. 他们假装成视察员进了学校。 来自《简明英汉词典》
• Inspectors checked that there was adequate ventilation. 检查员已检查过，通风良好。 来自《简明英汉词典》

18 demonstrations   

证明( demonstration的名词复数 )； 表明； 表达； 游行示威

参考例句：

• Lectures will be interspersed with practical demonstrations. 讲课中将不时插入实际示范。
• The new military government has banned strikes and demonstrations. 新的军人政府禁止罢工和示威活动。

19 unemployed   

adj.失业的，没有工作的；未动用的，闲置的

参考例句：

• There are now over four million unemployed workers in this country.这个国家现有四百万失业人员。
• The unemployed hunger for jobs.失业者渴望得到工作。