美国国家公共电台 NPR Pelosi Says Congress Should Pass New Laws So Sitting Presidents Can Be Indicted

 

AUDIE CORNISH, HOST:

Ridiculous - that's how President Trump¹ is describing allegations that he had improper² conversations with another foreign leader. They're reportedly at the heart of a whistleblower complaint from someone in the intelligence community. That complaint and the acting⁴ director of national intelligence's refusal to share it with Congress has resulted in a standoff between the executive and legislative⁵ branches of government.

President Trump says there's nothing wrong with how he talks to other world leaders during a news conference with Australian Prime Minister Scott Morrison today.

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PRESIDENT DONALD TRUMP: I've had conversations with many leaders. They're always appropriate. I think Scott can tell you they're always appropriate - at the highest level, always appropriate. And anything I do, I fight for this country. I fight so strongly for this country. It's just another political hack⁶ job.

ARI SHAPIRO, HOST:

Speaker of the House Nancy Pelosi doesn't see these accusations⁷ as a political hack job. I sat down with her this morning in a conference room just off her office along with NPR congressional correspondent Susan Davis, who begins this part of our conversation.

(SOUNDBITE OF ARCHIVED RECORDING)

SUSAN DAVIS, BYLINE⁸: I'm sure you're aware of the reports of a whistleblower raising questions about actions the president took. His personal attorney Rudy Giuliani said he spoke⁹ to the government of the Ukraine asking to investigate the Biden family. Just this morning, President Trump said, quote, "someone ought to look into Joe Biden," quote. Your reaction?

NANCY PELOSI: Just another example of the lack of integrity, decency¹⁰ and patriotism¹¹ on the part of this administration. We don't know the facts. We don't know if Ukraine is the country that is the subject of the telephone conversation. That remains¹² to be seen.

But what is a fact is the law. And the law says the director of national intelligence shall - not should, not may we encourage - shall convey the whistleblower information to the intelligence committees in the Congress. And right now, they are breaking the law.

DAVIS: To that end, if there is evidence that there is lawbreaking, or if there is evidence that the president is trying to interfere¹³ with the 2020 election by asking a foreign entity¹⁴ to investigate political opponents, does that change the calculation on impeachment¹⁵?

PELOSI: We've always been in search of the facts. And that is the calculus¹⁶, is what are the facts. We are in court on four cases right now - whether it's the president's taxes, whether it's his bank accounts, whether it's his accounting¹⁷ and his emoluments¹⁸. This case has a national security piece to it that is very alarming because the inspector¹⁹ general is appointed by President Trump. If, in fact, it is as is described, described this of urgency and of concern - and again, the law says the director of national intelligence shall send the information.

SHAPIRO: You refer to a lack of integrity, decency and patriotism by this president. You are...

PELOSI: And this administration. Let me have it be more of a blanket.

SHAPIRO: You are describing potential acts of lawbreaking. And many people will hear that and say, if Congress does not pursue impeachment, does it forever change the standard of what is acceptable behavior by any president?

PELOSI: I don't know about lawbreaking. I said we don't have the information. I don't want to suggest that I said that because we don't have the information. And while others may speculate, I have to go on the basis of the law and the facts. And that's where decisions will be made.

Our founders²⁰ could never suspect that a president would be so abusive of the Constitution of the United States that the separation of powers would be irrelevant²¹ to him and that he would continue - any president - would continue to withhold²² facts from the Congress, which are part of the constitutional right of inquiry²³. So this is in a different class in terms of his behavior. But again, the facts and the law.

I do think that we will have to pass some laws that will have clarity for future presidents. President should be indicted²⁴ if he's committed of wrongdoing, any president.

SHAPIRO: While in office?

PELOSI: Any president. There is nothing anyplace that says the president should not be indicted. That's...

DAVIS: It's the Justice Department interpretation²⁵.

PELOSI: ...Something cooked up by the president's lawyers - that's what that is - so that people will feel - OK, well, if he does something wrong, should be able to be indicted. The president should not be able to interpret that National Security Act as something that gives him free reign³ to do anything he wants by his personal declaration that something is an emergency. And it behooves²⁶ Congress to make sure - whether it's trade agreements that he says he has the ability to do this, that and the other thing, Congress has to retain its power in all of these arenas²⁷.

DAVIS: But hasn't he proven the point that Congress is not very strong right now and not very effective?

PELOSI: Well, he's at 38% in the polls. I think the public is making his own judgment²⁸ about him. And he will remain under 50% in the polls. Four or five of our candidates beat him when we haven't even decided²⁹ who our candidate is.

SHAPIRO: If I could pivot³⁰ to international affairs, Secretary of State Pompeo was in Saudi Arabia this week talking about a strike that the U.S. and the Saudis blame on Iran. Do you think military action in Iran should be on the table right now?

PELOSI: Absolutely not. I do not think that we have a responsibility to protect and defend Saudi Arabia. What agreement is that a part of?

SHAPIRO: Do you believe that if this administration decides to go to war with Iran that Congress would have an opportunity to make its voice heard as the Constitution requires?

PELOSI: Of course. But the president's authorities on going to war are unleashed³¹ if we are attacked. Saudi Arabia? Please. They're sitting across from a person who chopped up a reporter and dissolved his remains in chemicals, and he's sitting across the chair from the person suspected of leading that. I don't see any responsibility for us to protect and defend Saudi Arabia.

SHAPIRO: This White House has shown so little respect for congressional power. What makes you think it would respect congressional opposition³² to a military strike in Iran?

PELOSI: No, I don't think the president wants this strike in Iran. He's been advocating how wrong it was to go into Iraq after he decided he was against the war in Iraq. He knows there's no appetite in that country to go to war. We're paying a price for one of the biggest mistakes in our history, going into Iraq. And now we're in this war in Afghanistan because we neglected it to go into Iraq.

SHAPIRO: This president is so unpredictable. Do you worry...

PELOSI: Do I worry?

SHAPIRO: ...That something will happen in Iran that could pull the U.S. into war?

PELOSI: I worry about everything I worry about the Constitution. I worry about the environment. He - disloyal to the Constitution, degrades the environment, says we're not going make any decisions on the environment based on science. Oh, that's a good one. He denigrates³³ who we are as a people - by and large a nation of immigrants unless you're blessed to be born a Native American, which is a blessing³⁴ to all of us.

But he denigrates who we are. He devalues our value of the idea of America. So we have a difference. Elections are the place where you fight that out. If, in fact, the Congress needs to take action, we will. But we will not be guided by anything other than our responsibility to our oath of office and not politics or partisanship³⁵. It's not about that. It's about patriotism. And when it comes to declaring war, that power is vested in the Congress of the United States unless our country is attacked. Our country has not been attacked in the Saudi incident.

SHAPIRO: Madam Speaker, thank you for joining us today.

PELOSI: Thank you. My pleasure.

SHAPIRO: And in another part of the program, we hear more about the speaker's plan to lower the prices Americans pay for their prescription³⁶ drugs. Pelosi says this addresses a need President Trump should pay attention to.

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PELOSI: He may not have noticed, but in the last election, the health care issue, the cost of prescription drugs, was foremost for families, whether they were Democrats³⁷, Republicans or Independents or no interest in politics whatsoever³⁸ - God bless them.

(SOUNDBITE OF ALT-J SONG, "SOMETHING GOOD")

1 trump   

n.王牌，法宝；v.打出王牌，吹喇叭

参考例句：

• He was never able to trump up the courage to have a showdown.他始终鼓不起勇气摊牌。
• The coach saved his star player for a trump card.教练保留他的明星选手，作为他的王牌。

2 improper   

adj.不适当的，不合适的，不正确的，不合礼仪的

参考例句：

• Short trousers are improper at a dance.舞会上穿短裤不成体统。
• Laughing and joking are improper at a funeral.葬礼时大笑和开玩笑是不合适的。

3 reign   

n.统治时期，统治，支配，盛行；v.占优势

参考例句：

• The reign of Queen Elizabeth lapped over into the seventeenth century.伊丽莎白王朝延至17世纪。
• The reign of Zhu Yuanzhang lasted about 31 years.朱元璋统治了大约三十一年。

4 acting   

n.演戏，行为，假装；adj.代理的，临时的，演出用的

参考例句：

• Ignore her,she's just acting.别理她，她只是假装的。
• During the seventies,her acting career was in eclipse.在七十年代，她的表演生涯黯然失色。

5 legislative   

n.立法机构，立法权；adj.立法的，有立法权的

参考例句：

• Congress is the legislative branch of the U.S. government.国会是美国政府的立法部门。
• Today's hearing was just the first step in the legislative process.今天的听证会只是展开立法程序的第一步。

6 hack   

n.劈，砍，出租马车；v.劈，砍，干咳

参考例句：

• He made a hack at the log.他朝圆木上砍了一下。
• Early settlers had to hack out a clearing in the forest where they could grow crops.早期移民不得不在森林里劈出空地种庄稼。

7 accusations   

n.指责( accusation的名词复数 )；指控；控告；（被告发、控告的）罪名

参考例句：

• There were accusations of plagiarism. 曾有过关于剽窃的指控。
• He remained unruffled by their accusations. 对于他们的指控他处之泰然。

8 byline   

n.署名；v.署名

参考例句：

• His byline was absent as well.他的署名也不见了。
• We wish to thank the author of this article which carries no byline.我们要感谢这篇文章的那位没有署名的作者。

9 spoke   

n.（车轮的）辐条；轮辐；破坏某人的计划；阻挠某人的行动 v.讲，谈（speak的过去式）；说；演说；从某种观点来说

参考例句：

• They sourced the spoke nuts from our company.他们的轮辐螺帽是从我们公司获得的。
• The spokes of a wheel are the bars that connect the outer ring to the centre.辐条是轮子上连接外圈与中心的条棒。

10 decency   

n.体面，得体，合宜，正派，庄重

参考例句：

• His sense of decency and fair play made him refuse the offer.他的正直感和公平竞争意识使他拒绝了这一提议。
• Your behaviour is an affront to public decency.你的行为有伤风化。

11 patriotism   

n.爱国精神，爱国心，爱国主义

参考例句：

• His new book is a demonstration of his patriotism.他写的新书是他的爱国精神的证明。
• They obtained money under the false pretenses of patriotism.他们以虚伪的爱国主义为借口获得金钱。

12 remains   

n.剩余物，残留物；遗体，遗迹

参考例句：

• He ate the remains of food hungrily.他狼吞虎咽地吃剩余的食物。
• The remains of the meal were fed to the dog.残羹剩饭喂狗了。

13 interfere   

v.(in)干涉，干预；(with)妨碍，打扰

参考例句：

• If we interfere, it may do more harm than good.如果我们干预的话，可能弊多利少。
• When others interfere in the affair,it always makes troubles. 别人一卷入这一事件，棘手的事情就来了。

14 entity   

n.实体，独立存在体，实际存在物

参考例句：

• The country is no longer one political entity.这个国家不再是一个统一的政治实体了。
• As a separate legal entity,the corporation must pay taxes.作为一个独立的法律实体，公司必须纳税。

15 impeachment   

n.弹劾；控告；怀疑

参考例句：

• Impeachment is considered a drastic measure in the United States.在美国，弹劾被视为一种非常激烈的措施。
• The verdict resulting from his impeachment destroyed his political career.他遭弹劾后得到的判决毁了他的政治生涯。

16 calculus   

n.微积分；结石

参考例句：

• This is a problem where calculus won't help at all.对于这一题，微积分一点也用不上。
• After studying differential calculus you will be able to solve these mathematical problems.学了微积分之后，你们就能够解这些数学题了。

17 accounting   

n.会计，会计学，借贷对照表

参考例句：

• A job fell vacant in the accounting department.财会部出现了一个空缺。
• There's an accounting error in this entry.这笔账目里有差错。

18 emoluments   

n.报酬，薪水( emolument的名词复数 )

参考例句：

• The emoluments of this profession is not satisfactory. 此行业的报酬不令人满意。 来自辞典例句
• Emoluments connected with this position include free education for the children. 与这职务有关的酬劳包括为子女提供免费教育。 来自互联网

19 inspector   

n.检查员，监察员，视察员

参考例句：

• The inspector was interested in everything pertaining to the school.视察员对有关学校的一切都感兴趣。
• The inspector was shining a flashlight onto the tickets.查票员打着手电筒查看车票。

20 founders   

n.创始人( founder的名词复数 )

参考例句：

• He was one of the founders of the university's medical faculty. 他是该大学医学院的创建人之一。 来自辞典例句
• The founders of our religion made this a cornerstone of morality. 我们宗教的创始人把这看作是道德的基石。 来自辞典例句

21 irrelevant   

adj.不恰当的，无关系的，不相干的

参考例句：

• That is completely irrelevant to the subject under discussion.这跟讨论的主题完全不相关。
• A question about arithmetic is irrelevant in a music lesson.在音乐课上，一个数学的问题是风马牛不相及的。

22 withhold   

v.拒绝，不给；使停止，阻挡

参考例句：

• It was unscrupulous of their lawyer to withhold evidence.他们的律师隐瞒证据是不道德的。
• I couldn't withhold giving some loose to my indignation.我忍不住要发泄一点我的愤怒。

23 inquiry   

n.打听，询问，调查，查问

参考例句：

• Many parents have been pressing for an inquiry into the problem.许多家长迫切要求调查这个问题。
• The field of inquiry has narrowed down to five persons.调查的范围已经缩小到只剩5个人了。

24 indicted   

控告，起诉( indict的过去式和过去分词 )

参考例句：

• The senator was indicted for murder. 那位参议员被控犯谋杀罪。
• He was indicted by a grand jury on two counts of murder. 他被大陪审团以两项谋杀罪名起诉。

25 interpretation   

n.解释，说明，描述；艺术处理

参考例句：

• His statement admits of one interpretation only.他的话只有一种解释。
• Analysis and interpretation is a very personal thing.分析与说明是个很主观的事情。

26 behooves   

n.利益，好处( behoof的名词复数 )v.适宜( behoove的第三人称单数 )

参考例句：

• It behooves us to help the needy. 我们应当帮助贫困者。 来自辞典例句
• It behooves a child to obey his parents. 子女应当服从父母。 来自辞典例句

27 arenas   

表演场地( arena的名词复数 )； 竞技场； 活动或斗争的场所或场面； 圆形运动场

参考例句：

• Demolition derbies are large-scale automobile rodeos that take place in big arenas. 撞车比赛指的是在很大的竞技场上举行的大型汽车驾驶技术表演。
• Are there areas of privacy in the most public of arenas? 在绝大部分公开的场合中存在需要保护隐私的领域吗？

28 judgment   

n.审判；判断力，识别力，看法，意见

参考例句：

• The chairman flatters himself on his judgment of people.主席自认为他审视人比别人高明。
• He's a man of excellent judgment.他眼力过人。

29 decided   

adj.决定了的，坚决的；明显的，明确的

参考例句：

• This gave them a decided advantage over their opponents.这使他们比对手具有明显的优势。
• There is a decided difference between British and Chinese way of greeting.英国人和中国人打招呼的方式有很明显的区别。

30 pivot   

v.在枢轴上转动；装枢轴，枢轴；adj.枢轴的

参考例句：

• She is the central pivot of creation and represents the feminine aspect in all things.她是创造的中心枢轴，表现出万物的女性面貌。
• If a spring is present,the hand wheel will pivot on the spring.如果有弹簧，手轮的枢轴会装在弹簧上。

31 unleashed   

v.把（感情、力量等）释放出来，发泄( unleash的过去式和过去分词 )

参考例句：

• The government's proposals unleashed a storm of protest in the press. 政府的提案引发了新闻界的抗议浪潮。
• The full force of his rage was unleashed against me. 他把所有的怒气都发泄在我身上。 来自《简明英汉词典》

32 opposition   

n.反对，敌对

参考例句：

• The party leader is facing opposition in his own backyard.该党领袖在自己的党內遇到了反对。
• The police tried to break down the prisoner's opposition.警察设法制住了那个囚犯的反抗。

33 denigrates   

v.诋毁，诽谤( denigrate的第三人称单数 )

参考例句：

• The line is clever, but it unfairly denigrates the predictive power of stock markets. 话说的很聪明，但却不公平地贬低了股市的预测能力。 来自互联网

34 blessing   

n.祈神赐福；祷告；祝福，祝愿

参考例句：

• The blessing was said in Hebrew.祷告用了希伯来语。
• A double blessing has descended upon the house.双喜临门。

35 Partisanship   

n. 党派性, 党派偏见

参考例句：

• Her violent partisanship was fighting Soames's battle. 她的激烈偏袒等于替索米斯卖气力。
• There was a link of understanding between them, more important than affection or partisanship. ' 比起人间的感情，比起相同的政见，这一点都来得格外重要。 来自英汉文学

36 prescription   

n.处方，开药；指示，规定

参考例句：

• The physician made a prescription against sea- sickness for him.医生给他开了个治晕船的药方。
• The drug is available on prescription only.这种药只能凭处方购买。

37 democrats   

n.民主主义者，民主人士( democrat的名词复数 )

参考例句：

• The Democrats held a pep rally on Capitol Hill yesterday. 民主党昨天在国会山召开了竞选誓师大会。
• The democrats organize a filibuster in the senate. 民主党党员组织了阻挠议事。 来自《简明英汉词典》

38 whatsoever   

adv.（用于否定句中以加强语气）任何；pron.无论什么

参考例句：

• There's no reason whatsoever to turn down this suggestion.没有任何理由拒绝这个建议。
• All things whatsoever ye would that men should do to you,do ye even so to them.你想别人对你怎样，你就怎样对人。